Well, I of course, am the nice one. But I don’t think you are snarky either.

So tis all good, since you know, this is all about me

Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe.

Cough, cough, cough.

Oh, now, look what you done, Sybil. Made me start coughing again. Snicker.

Actually, that about sums up what I have to say since I don’t review and have always said that up front. I talk about the books, nothing more, nothing less. Sometimes I like them. Sometimes I don’t. The whole “reviews” discussion usually makes my head explode anyway. It just gets redundant after a while.

My kids always kept reading journals at school and the teachers said, daily, do not retell the story. I want to know how the book made you feel. What is it about? Why do you like it. Etc…And I agree. If I want a retell, I’ll go to amazon. I snooze off when there is no reader personality reflected in the review. The blogs I visit I do so by choice. I like those folks and their style. I think of many of them as my book group because we enjoy many of the same books. I don’t care if they get snarky. Sometimes a book deserves a good snark.

All art is subject to criticism. Snarking the author personally is an entirely different matter and that’s not my thing.

Well. That Orson Scott Card thing had my knickers in a twist….

So tis all good, since you know, this is all about me

The only thing I object to is when the reviewer uses the review as an excuse to attack the author, not the book.

I tend to think that most authors tend to see slice and dice reviews as personal attacks, because some of them view their own books, as an extension of themselves. That’ll never change because some people are just ova-sen-sa-teeve that way.

Or when the reviewer sees herself as more important than the book, and the snark becomes the thing, rather than the book.

Hey, on my blog, I’ll always think I’m far more important than the book, because quite frankly, I’m the one who read it. It should be all about me, and what I think.

I have to say, I’ve never really considered myself as snarky, that’s a label that I’ve been given. I prefer to think of myself as honest, and yes, sarcastic and cutting can also be levelled at me. ‘Snark’ is one of those American words that hasn’t made its way into my everyday life, and nor would I wish it to.

As for Amazon reviews, I can’t say I read them.

No clue about San Fran. I had pretty much decided not to months and months ago but now not so sure. So it is something I need to give some thought.

What is the difference between TGTBTU and Vey? Well I pay for this blog, I take care of it and make it run. So yes I am god in TGTBTU land and can do whatever I want.

Is Vey wrong? No I think Publisher Weekly is because if they are going to be a “a nationally distributed media source” Barbara Vey, as nice as she is, is not a good face on Romance. Of course I feel the same way about Lifetime.

Is it any wonder people think romance is trite, stupid, poorly written and not for those with a brain when those “affiliated with a nationally distributed media source” think we are in the 50s, need to only be nice, smile and lie to each other because god forbid we have a thought, voice it and confuse the other stupid women who of course can’t think on their own.

So yes I have issue with the limited number of press passes going to a few ‘nice’ girls who do the real interesting reviews, interviews and you know ask the authors their favorite cover model. And the newspapers who look down on the genre.

Woot! go team romance

I don’t care if everyone and their mother thinks romance is nothing more than trash. But I do care that the only info I can get is to tell me about the trash or gosh darn just how nice the authors looked in their purdy dresses.

I don’t know why RWA limited press badges this year; perhaps they got tons of requests from obscure review sites and random bloggers and just drew a line that was easy to see. Maybe they could have done it differently (web traffic, volume of content, something). And I agree it is a good thing that some sites like SB and DA can afford to go and will, but you know what? There are plenty of authors who can’t afford to go–and every paying attendee is subsidizing every non-paying attendee.

Caroline, it had nothing to do really about you but my ramble was off of your comment. So to keep people from thinking I was speaking TO you…. LOL guess it didn’t work eh?

And Vey, yeah she does if RWA is going to hold up PW as ‘real media’ but not DA, not SB, not AAR, not us or what BB is working toward. So much more play into it than a name, there are review sites changing ad rates with less traffic than some personal reader blogs. So if the judge of what is a true source of news is nothing more than being “affiliated with a nationally distributed media source” Vey is doing readers a serious disservice but hey, she is being nice and I am sure the authors adore that.

As for Roxi, that was more of a personal thing I guess. If I can’t tell what doesn’t work for you, what does work for you means nothing. I am not saying she is a bad person or that she is lying but that her reviews mean nothing to me as a book buyer.

Are authors in a rough spot… sure they could be… but I my choice as a reader is an author says nothing if it isn’t ‘nice’ I want them to say nothing period. Of course that is prolly just me.

Shit, I already forgot.

Anyway… There have been conversations on and off in romance blogland for quite a while about what is a ‘proper’ review and what ain’t. The blurb? Often wrong in the details, or emphasizing the wrong/minor aspect of the story (S. Brockmann’s “All Through the Night” is the most recent example I can remember right now.) And that is when the blurb doesn’t give away the MAIN plot point or twist that makes the story so satisfying on the first read.

I am trying, right now, to write a series of reviews for a board that’s struggling, and I’m finding that I admire those who can articulate their feelings for a book without simply gushing–the best of the best book EVAH!!!! in the history of writing!–or simply eviscerating–the worst pile of drivel any mind ever spewed in public.

It’s not that a positive review can’t be well written, thoughtful, critical–I mean, even the very best of books have flaws!–nor conversely than a well written negative review can’t move a particular reader to seek out that book. S/he may be looking for exactly those plot elements (for example) that made the reviewer blink/shudder/retch. I think that what a review should do is provoke curiosity about the book. Motivate the reviewer’s audience to find out more about the book. More often than not this will result in sales–even if only for the “I can’t believe how BAD this book is touted to be! I gotta see this trainwreck for myself!” And who knows? A reader buying for the rubbernecking may end up liking the work itself.

On the other hand… ’cause yeah, I have two–and sometimes three or more.

On the other hand, I understand why writers–especially if they are published themselves–would rather not give negative or even neutral reviews of other writers. Are they all weenies for doing so? I don’t think so. I think the smart thing to do is not to wily-nilly piss off your colleagues–or rather, piss in the pool you too are swimming in. Does that mean that every positive review they publish anywhere has to be gushing sunshine and rainbows? Hell, no! I hope to goodness a writer worth his/her salt can write a thoughtful and critical review, even if s/he only writes positive reviews.

The one thing that bugs me on behalf of reviews sites are the visitor/commenters who demand change in format or tone. “You are oh so mean!” or “You use foul language!” or whatever variation. It’s like inviting someone over to your house, and having them tell you how you should redecorate the living room, and buy new kitchen appliances because they couldn’t live with it as it is. What on earth?

I will shut up now, not touching the trollery bit cause… well, just ’cause.

I am glad I don’t frequent this blog in question, and after reading your post I probably never will. I have a handful of reader blogs I stick to, people who are lovers of the genre, and discuss its merits and disadvantages in an ethical way. I have been reviewing since 2003 and learned a tremendous amount since then. I have always written honest reviews, and I remember, when one of my very first reviews (I was young and starry-eyed) for a site which shall not be mentioned here, was about an erotic romance I simply thought to be atrocious. I explained my reasons and stated my conclusions, and a few days later came a message from the epublisher (a well known and established at that) that it is unacceptable to publish a review with only two points (out of five) and if the offending thing in question could please be removed.

Needless to say I stopped requesting books from this site and never spent a dollar there.

I admit I am a person who is rather easily influenced when it comes to online behaviour of authors. I have tried out authors whose online voice I immensely liked and most often got very lucky, others I would never touch with a ten foot pole because of their blog comments alone.

I understand that an author puts a lot of work into his babies, cuddles and pampers them, grows angry and shouts at their misbehaviour … and in the end is convinced to have done his best. Then there comes a reviewer and says it sux, it’s crap and practically tears apart months of labour of love.

It is not fair, but duh, that’s life. I teach children every day and quickly needed to grow a thick skin. Everybody working in a remotely competitive surrounding will be confronted with challenging and “mean” situations once in a while. This is called growing up and dealing with people who are not always fair and who may not have the same ethical standard you do. It boils down to either showing class … or not.

Authors need to give us credit as readers. We do have brains. Why would anyone assume I couldn’t read a post, review or comment and not see it for what it was? Why is it assumed that if it is in print it will ALWAYS be believed? I have had one blogger in 3 years tell me she expects to be believed, always, everyone else I have ever asked excepts and assumes readers will use their brains and decide for themselves.

Word. This is what always makes me frothy when these discussions come up. If an author can clearly see if a review is useless crap, why can’t a reader?

And most of the stuff posted on Amazon is useless, really. I don’t even think authors should worry about that.

So, are they COMPLETELY worthless? No, not at all. When I’m weeding through hundreds of books trying to research what is worth buying, I look at a few 5 star comments to see what people loved about the book, then a few 3 stars and lower comments to see what the worst of the complaints are. There has actually been many a time that the 3 star and lower comments have SOLD the book to me, and just as many times that the 5 star comments made me realize the book just wasn’t of interest to me.

As for review sites where every single book is a 4.5-5.0 star, heart, clover, or other Lucky Charms marshmallow– well, to me, those sites exist for the AUTHORS only and have no benefit to me as a Reader. There are a couple of sites I’ve dropped because I strongly suspect they are PAID REVIEWS.

It stands to reason that a review site (including TGTBTU) would be skewed toward higher grades because we, as reviewers, select what books interest us. But, when every book is ONE OF MY FAVORITE BOOKS EVER and every author is ONE OF MY FAVORITE AUTHORS EVER, then you’ve got no business calling yourself a review site– YOU ARE AN AUTHOR PROMO SITE. Period.

So sez I. *wink*

Oh, and don’t get me started on the organized “attack posts” at Amazon. I AM a Laurell Hamilton fan, you know.

A lot of authors go by Roxanne St. Claire’s statement. Here’s how you can interpret it: “if I say this book is good, I think it’s really good. No, like REALLY good, you should go buy it right now and clear your calendar.” Many authors would view a negative or critical review of their book, by another author, as friendly fire. Sure, we expect the take some hits on review sites and blogs and Amazon, but…et tu, Brute? I don’t see how that has to render a review by Roxanne St. Claire useless; she didn’t say, “I would pick and choose something nice to say about a book even if I overall hated it, because it would be mean to say I hated it.” THAT would be disingenuous. (I don’t know Roxanne at all, btw, but I love her name; always did, from Cyrano…sigh…)

I think you’re reading too much into Barbara Vey’s reluctance to post reviews. She’s not OBLIGATED to do so; just as you are free to post whatever your thoughts are on a book, she’s just as free not to. Reviews DO influence people, sometimes for good (OMG, I never would have tried this awesome book if you hadn’t told me it was so good!) or bad (you skank, you said this sucked so I didn’t read it for two years and now I think it’s awesome!). I think there used to be this site called http://www.romanticadvances.com that was just going to post blurbs of upcoming books, to let people see what was coming out soon to help them write their TBB lists… wonder what happened to that site… it seemed like a nice idea…

But I think I get the gist of your post.

Loving something doesn’t mean you should blind to the criticism of it. Criticism is crucial because criticism points out what needs to be changed~or at least well-written or well-articulated criticism should. Constructive criticism is a useful tool in most, in not all areas of life.

I’m not a reviewer. For many reasons, one of them being because I have no desire to be. Another one, reviews do tend to get a bit more notice and consideration if it’s not something along the lines of….

this bk totally sux. dont buy it.

But I’m not always the diplomatic type. I rarely analyze why I didn’t like a book. So I can’t always explain just why in terms of other than… it didn’t work for me.

More, too often for an author, it can be a dicey road saying that you didn’t care for a book, even if you politely state just that. Especially if it’s a popular author. You can either have fellow authors think you’re picking on somebody, that you’re trying to score points against some imagined competition, or you face the risk of having some overly zealous fans decide you have a hate-on for this author and it’s their mission in life to cure you of it.

There are enough reviewers out there and since I have no desire to do it, I’ll leave to those who enjoy it. The few times I do gush about a book, it’s one that I’ve truly enjoyed. But it’s my opinion and choice, and not because I was asked to do so.

One person’s opinion should count as much as anybody else’s. I am firmly of the mind that a well-thought out opinion is going to be received more openly than just a rant. Rants are equivalent to yelling and when people yell at me, I often tune them out. But not everybody thinks the same, not everybody feels the same and that’s fine.

If I don’t like the way a person presents their opinion, I’ll most likely leave before trying to get to the bottom of what the opinion is. No sweat off my shoulders. But if it’s an opinion that clashes with mine, as long as it’s well thought out, I’ll probably hang around long enough to see what this person has to to say and if I feel moved, throw in my own two cents.

Criticism doesn’t always equal mean girl and the writers who think so need to develop thicker skin. This is a business~yes, we take things a little more personally than other businesses, but writing is a personal thing. It comes from inside. It’s natural to be protective of it. But if you put words to paper/PC/Column/blog/whatever, you’re going to eventually get criticized and that’s just a fact. Sometimes you can learn from that criticism, but if you’re going to take it personally, you’re better off just not reading it.

Totally agree but I think those people, those reviews… it is pretty obvious. Don’t you?

And life’s too short to read crap, much less spend much time talking about it. Unless it’s really crappy crap – then it’s kind of fun to point out the particularly craptastic bits. And, really, why shouldn’t we?